finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

You know the drill..

Moderators: Redneck_Randy, badmoonrising, lakerunner

Post Reply
Message
Author
User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#1 Post by mzodarg » Sun Sep 04, 2016 3:29 am

Got the above installed yesterday, was a fairly simple install other than an electric issue. Initially when I installed the wiring I used a wire under the console that was fused, kept blowing the fuse when raising the frame with no canvas installed. The wire I used was thin and I assumed since it provided 12V, I was good.

After trying to raise the frame and blowing fuses, I replaced the thin wire (maybe 20 gauge) with a 14 gauge wire and it would still blow the fuse when raising the frame. After blowing 5 15 amp fuses, I connect the wire directly to the fuse panel feed (no fuse) and then put the positive to the 6amp breaker (also had the 6 amp breaker installed when it kept blowing fuses). Now it trips the breaker when raising.

I then hooked everything to a 12V trolling motor battery I have under the console and it works flawless.

My next step is to wire directly into the fuse panel feed with some 6 Gauge wire and double check the ground. Wire the hot to the 6amp breaker and see what happens.

I'm open to suggestions.....

Mike
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
Heatman
Posts: 1403
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:48 pm
Location: Sheridan Indiana

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#2 Post by Heatman » Sun Sep 04, 2016 3:38 am

Really need to know the amp draw of the motor to solve the problem
2014 Tracker Targa V-18 Combo/ Mercury 150hp 4 stroke
'06 Dodge 1500 QC 4x4 Big Horn Hemi
Sheridan, Indiana

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#3 Post by mzodarg » Sun Sep 04, 2016 4:07 am

Heatman wrote:Really need to know the amp draw of the motor to solve the problem
No idea, but the bimini was shipped with a 6 amp breaker, so I would say less than 6??
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
teecro
Posts: 1028
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:23 am
Location: Sunset Bay, TN

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#4 Post by teecro » Sun Sep 04, 2016 7:27 am

mzodarg wrote: I then hooked everything to a 12V trolling motor battery I have under the console and it works flawless.
Worked flawless with or without a fuse?

What about the negative wire where was it hooked, directly to the battery or buss bar? If your negative was questionable that can cause issues.

I'd not use wire smaller than 14 gauge on anything but gauges and dash lights etc, 14 is good for at least 15 amps and 12 is good for at least 20 amps...
T CRO
2017 Berkshire CTS 24 RFX with Yamaha F150/Simomized 200
2015 Caravelle 16 EBo with Mercury 90

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#5 Post by mzodarg » Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:19 pm

teecro wrote:
mzodarg wrote: I then hooked everything to a 12V trolling motor battery I have under the console and it works flawless.
Worked flawless with or without a fuse?

What about the negative wire where was it hooked, directly to the battery or buss bar? If your negative was questionable that can cause issues.
r.
I'd not use wire smaller than 14 gauge on anything but gauges and dash lights etc, 14 is good for at least 15 amps and 12 is good for at least 20 amps...
Negative was connected at the buss bar. I tried the 8 gauge wire and still had the same issue. I believe my ground is suspect. Ran 10 gauge to the battery positive and negative, worked great.
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
wickerbill
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:10 pm

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#6 Post by wickerbill » Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:58 am

I posted this awhile back.....FWIW I'm running a 14 gauge wire on mine.

I can offer one "gotcha" that I experienced after installing the power top on my boat. It was of my own doing and not a fault of the the top.

Mine kept popping the auto-reset breaker when being lowered. After removing the remote box and just wiring to the switch direct with the same results, tying to a dedicated wire from the battery, I finally removed the canvas and the cross tube of the powered bows and ran them independently. They both ran fine.

As it turns out when installing the cross tube in the powered bows, I was over zealous on making sure the powered bow tubes came down completely square on the second bow. The result of this was the powered bows were being pushed out to the point of putting the bows into a bind in the drive head pivot channels. I then put the cross tube in place and ran the assembeled bow with no screws in it and let it find it's own spread throughout the cycle. I then just put 1 screw back into the cross tube and am letting the other end "float" as needed. Haven't had a problem since. Works like a dream...love it!
Some people try to turn back their odometers. Not me, I want people to know 'why' I look this way. I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

2014 Berkshire STS 231RFC
115 Mercury 4 stroke

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#7 Post by mzodarg » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:49 am

wickerbill wrote:I posted this awhile back.....FWIW I'm running a 14 gauge wire on mine.

I can offer one "gotcha" that I experienced after installing the power top on my boat. It was of my own doing and not a fault of the the top.

Mine kept popping the auto-reset breaker when being lowered. After removing the remote box and just wiring to the switch direct with the same results, tying to a dedicated wire from the battery, I finally removed the canvas and the cross tube of the powered bows and ran them independently. They both ran fine.

As it turns out when installing the cross tube in the powered bows, I was over zealous on making sure the powered bow tubes came down completely square on the second bow. The result of this was the powered bows were being pushed out to the point of putting the bows into a bind in the drive head pivot channels. I then put the cross tube in place and ran the assembeled bow with no screws in it and let it find it's own spread throughout the cycle. I then just put 1 screw back into the cross tube and am letting the other end "float" as needed. Haven't had a problem since. Works like a dream...love it!
Wickerbill,
Thanks for bringing the binding to my attention, something else for me to look at. What really blew my mind was that it did not pop the inline breaker when attached to the trolling motor battery, but would when hooked directly to the breaker box feeds.
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
joe20toon
Posts: 867
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:59 am
Location: Central Florida

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#8 Post by joe20toon » Wed Sep 07, 2016 4:15 am

Can you post a video or two on YouTube?
2016 20 foot Sylvan RPT (V Pontoons)
Yamaha Vmax SHO 115HP
80 Pound Thrust RipTide Trolling Motor
Humminbird Helix 7 Side Imaging

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#9 Post by mzodarg » Thu Sep 08, 2016 6:06 am

I took advice from WickerBill (thanks by the way) and loosened the screws on the actuator Bow, in fact I removed the cross beam, rewired everything to the fuse panel, put a new fuse in and actuated the switch to raise the pole (Bimini was removed) Low and behold it Blew the fuse again. Did the same thing on the trolling motor battery(replaced the fuse) and was as smooth as butter.

Called power-arm yesterday I ran this by a tech (Marty). He believes I may have a dead short (pinched wire) under the actuator. Since my trolling motor battery isn't grounded, and it works fine on that battery. I haven't checked it out yet, I'm still trying to figure out if that's the case, why does it work going down and only blows the fuse when its moving up when hooked to fuse box. A short is a short.

Before I remove the actuators and check for a pinched wire, I'm going to ground the trolling motor battery and test this theory. In theory if the trolling motor battery is grounded it should pop the 6amp breaker if in fact I have a pinched wire. If the breaker pops, I plan to test one actuator at a time by removing the wires from one and giving it a try, if that remaining actuator works I'll disconnect it and wire the other one up to ensure it pops the breaker.
Last edited by mzodarg on Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
wickerbill
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:10 pm

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#10 Post by wickerbill » Thu Sep 08, 2016 6:40 am

Sorry my advice didn't solve your problem....

It sounds like the common denominator here is the fuse panel. What size wire runs to it? What other devices does the panel power? If they are relative low draw items, I.E., radio, lights etc. it might be adequate for them but not for the amp draw of the actuators.

Crookedlaker and I work together and we've been playing "stump the staff". I agree with you that if there's a pinched wire causing a short that it should effect it in either direction. I also agree with you running them independently BEFORE removing the actuator from the rail. That will either eliminate or confirm a problem with them.

If all is well there I have to believe that the problem lies with the power connection or ground not being robust enough to supply the current needed for the actuators. Not knowing what the panel looks like this is just a guess on my part. CL and I both have dedicated wires from the battery for the top, and it looks like yours runs fine in the configuration as well. That might be your best option...just say'in....

I'm sort of confused with the "tech" comment on the panel battery being grounded. I can only assume he is talking about a common ground point similar to negative ground point in a car. I've owned a few boats and none of them had a common ground point for the battery(s)....they've always had a hot and a ground for each device.
Some people try to turn back their odometers. Not me, I want people to know 'why' I look this way. I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved.

2014 Berkshire STS 231RFC
115 Mercury 4 stroke

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#11 Post by mzodarg » Thu Sep 08, 2016 7:21 am

wickerbill wrote:Sorry my advice didn't solve your problem....

It sounds like the common denominator here is the fuse panel. What size wire runs to it? What other devices does the panel power? If they are relative low draw items, I.E., radio, lights etc. it might be adequate for them but not for the amp draw of the actuators.

Crookedlaker and I work together and we've been playing "stump the staff". I agree with you that if there's a pinched wire causing a short that it should effect it in either direction. I also agree with you running them independently BEFORE removing the actuator from the rail. That will either eliminate or confirm a problem with them.

If all is well there I have to believe that the problem lies with the power connection or ground not being robust enough to supply the current needed for the actuators. Not knowing what the panel looks like this is just a guess on my part. CL and I both have dedicated wires from the battery for the top, and it looks like yours runs fine in the configuration as well. That might be your best option...just say'in....

I'm sort of confused with the "tech" comment on the panel battery being grounded. I can only assume he is talking about a common ground point similar to negative ground point in a car. I've owned a few boats and none of them had a common ground point for the battery(s)....they've always had a hot and a ground for each device.
Thanks for the reply. The wire gauge from the battery to the fuse panel looks like a 6 or 8 gauge wire, I'm assuming that would be sufficient. I've actually turned on every thing that I can to include both live wells (all at the same time) without any issues. This tells me the ground is sufficient.

What the tech was talking about is that my trolling motor battery is not grounded unlike the boat battery since the ground runs to the outboard and it's bolted to the transom that would ground the battery. :donno

I just got off the phone with him asking the same questions on a dead short should effect the issue either up or down on the switch he agreed, but he stated it could be when raising the top up that there is more amps required. He mentioned that there may be another issue that I need to check on the mounting bolts being to long and causing an issue, not sure exactly how that might be an issue but I'm going to add another washer to all four bolts.

I'm gonna head up to the boat at lunch and see what I come up with, first thing I'm going to do is drive a ground stake in the ground hook a strap to it and run that to the trolling motor battery, that battery should be grounded just like the boat battery in theory it should pop the breaker when raised.

Mike
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#12 Post by mzodarg » Thu Sep 08, 2016 12:22 pm

So I get to the boat at lunch, ground the trolling motor battery and it works flawless. Theory number 1 $hitCanned.

Next thing I do is loosen both bolts on one side and lift the motor, wires are all tucked in the channel no pinch issue so I remove one bolt and add another washer, tighten it back down and do the same to the other bolt. I then disconnect the other side motor, hook up the power to the breaker box feed thru the 6amp breaker and hit the switch. Worked as smooth as a guy could wan it to.

So I did the same on the other side, all wires where buried nicely in the channel with no visible pinches. I then add a washer to each bolt, tighten the actuator down, hooked it back up and viola, works with no issue.

re-zipped the Bimini top on and again worked great.

I did call Power-Arm after I was done (one arm was raising faster then the other) and the tech told me that when you use the switch hold it until the 6 amp breaker trips every time, he siad this will keep the motors timed to raise and lower together, I tried it four or five times and now both arms are in sysnc.

The theory behind the washer is the bolts were hitting the actuator and when power was supplied from the fuse box it would blow a fuse or trip the breaker due to the length of the source wires, when I was using the trolling batter, I was 12" from the power source versus 15'.

I'm sure glad the tech mentioned that this morning when I called them!

Damn I'm glad that's solved!


Mike
Last edited by mzodarg on Fri Sep 09, 2016 6:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

crookedlaker
Posts: 184
Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 7:45 am
Location: angola IN

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#13 Post by crookedlaker » Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:24 am

the arms on mine are also out of sync. Are you suppose to run until the breaker trips every time or only until they arms are synced
I have tired unplugging the motors to get them running the same but it really doesn't work. I am probably the only one that notices that they are not in sync.

Mike
2017 Harris Sunliner 200
Tri-toon P+ Package
2017 Mercury 150 4 stroke

2014 Harris Cruiser 200 Sold!!
2014 Mercury 90 four stroke (120 HP via Simon Motorsports) Sold!!

User avatar
mzodarg
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:07 am
Location: S.W. Oklahoma

Re: finally got the electric bimini installed, questions.

#14 Post by mzodarg » Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:54 am

crookedlaker wrote:the arms on mine are also out of sync. Are you suppose to run until the breaker trips every time or only until they arms are synced
I have tired unplugging the motors to get them running the same but it really doesn't work. I am probably the only one that notices that they are not in sync.

Mike
Yes the tech told me that they are in the process of updating the instructions, he told me that every time you fully open or close the top to hold the switch until the breaker pops and this will keep the motors in sync or "timed" as he put it. It certainly worked for me as I had about a 4 sec lag between motors and now they lift together.

One other thing I did after work yesterday is I removed the back bolts and looked for any sign of rubbing on the ends and sure enough both of them had witness marks and a slight groove in them. Nothing on the front bolts.

Mike
[color=#0000FF]2015 Sun Tracker 22' DLX Fishn Barge-Schwintek power Bimini-Merc Eco Monitor
2015 Mercury 90hp (Simon Motorsports tuned )Command Thrust FourStroke[b] not worth the coin

[/color]

Post Reply