Talk me in or out of strakes

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Bamaman
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#31 Post by Bamaman » Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:43 am

ronb wrote:I haven't seen it mentioned on here, but adding strakes to the outside of the tubes will cause it to 'dig' if you try cornering when you are at running speed. Last year I had the opportunity to use a Bennington with strakes and I did not expect that when I made a sharp(ish) turn under full throttle. It dug so hard that it splashed water up and over the railing. My SouthBay does not have any strakes. I've been thinking that I'd add a larger diameter center tube before adding strakes.

I am running a 90hp, maxing out around 24MPH on a clear day with no wind and just the 4 of us (2 adults, 2 kids under 40lbs each). There is another guy on my lake with a SouthBay 925CR with a tri-toon and a 115HP Merc and he was claiming 35MPH. Could be fish stories, but after the experience with the Benny and strakes, I'm going to try the third tube first.

Just food for thought..
I would add underskinning and strakes first and see how the boat runs--before adding a third toon. With 90 hp, it may suit your needs just fine.

Adding a larger center toon may be asking for trouble, as you don't have the engineering resources of the manufacturer. They spend quite a bit of time on the water with tritoons and strakes.

Some manufacturers put stakes on inside and outside of two toons. Some with 3 toons put them on the inside of the outside toons and on both sides of the center toon. One major manufacturer puts on both sides of all toons. To me, if the nosecone is out of the water, the strakes are doing their job.

The third toon adds a couple of hundred pounds and increases drag. Straight ahead performance with 25" toons and strakes will probably be slightly better than the tritoon. The tritoon will handle better and increase weight carrying capacity, however. The same size third toon is really best with 115 hp or 150 hp motors.
'12 Bennington 24' SSLX Yamaha 150

smoker62
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#32 Post by smoker62 » Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:14 am

OK, to add to the strakes price I got for a pair to weld to the inners of the twin tubes , the 3/4 tube from SB would be 1960 plus 500 shipping and 300 to crate plus tax. The strakes do not come welded on the center tube for some reason so add the earlier 316 for another set of strakes and your welder mounting them on the 3/4 tube as well. With my current 115 setup and possible 150 but unsure yet, I will try the two outer strakes first and see what it does.
2014 Crest Classic 250 SLR2 , Mercury 300 Verado Pro , Mercury Enertia Prop
2012 South Bay 522 , Merc 115 4S, Mercury Spitfire 4 blade prop-13 pitch light 25 mph gps, 11 pitch heavy - Sold

Bamaman
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#33 Post by Bamaman » Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:14 pm

Since you're in Kenosha and so close to Racine, have you checked with Great Lakes Skipper to see if they have any toons you can mount in the middle?

They often carry full toons of different kinds--seconds.

That OEM 3rd toon would be a solid buy, but transportation and crating is kind'a high. They'd just throw it on another pontoon boat delivery at a net zero cost to them.
'12 Bennington 24' SSLX Yamaha 150

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ToonGuy
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#34 Post by ToonGuy » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:02 pm

smoker62 wrote:OK, to add to the strakes price I got for a pair to weld to the inners of the twin tubes , the 3/4 tube from SB would be 1960 plus 500 shipping and 300 to crate plus tax. The strakes do not come welded on the center tube for some reason so add the earlier 316 for another set of strakes and your welder mounting them on the 3/4 tube as well. With my current 115 setup and possible 150 but unsure yet, I will try the two outer strakes first and see what it does.
That's because South Bay doesn't offer a sport center tube with strakes. It would be a custom deal...
Just one boat...after another, after another :-)

Bamaman
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#35 Post by Bamaman » Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:25 pm

Bennington's Express center tube has strakes, and it picks the three nosecones out of the water just fine. I'm getting 40 mph with 150 hp Yammie and a 15 pitch Reliance prop--6% slip.

I would think they're not very hard to install since the center pod, fuel lines, etc. are not touched.
'12 Bennington 24' SSLX Yamaha 150

pond tuuunes
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#36 Post by pond tuuunes » Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:57 pm

Smoker, call Fox lake propeller 8475875600, they repaired the strakes on my toon, they do great work, for a good price. JT
2002 playcraft extreme,26', I/O, 498 ci, 625 hp, 580 ft pounds of torgue, Dart alluminum heads, holly 850 carb, bravo XR drive. GPS 76 mph.

smoker62
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#37 Post by smoker62 » Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:22 am

Will do, thanks for the tips guys !
2014 Crest Classic 250 SLR2 , Mercury 300 Verado Pro , Mercury Enertia Prop
2012 South Bay 522 , Merc 115 4S, Mercury Spitfire 4 blade prop-13 pitch light 25 mph gps, 11 pitch heavy - Sold

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DRock
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#38 Post by DRock » Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:56 am

Well i haven't pulled the trigger yet. I'm starting to have mixed feelings. My biggest fear is not improving speed, or hurting speed and there's no turning back once they're welded on. It would require new toons if i messed up the placement, sizing, etc.

I was able to find perfect conditions over the weekend and with just me, full tank, top down, i hit 31mph gps with my cheapo aluminum prop. I'm tempted to just find the right SS propeller, maybe gain a mph or so, and leave it alone. Thoughts?
2006 20' Odyssey 220C. 2006 Mercury 90 4s. Underskinned, jackplate. 13.5x15 SS prop. 31mph gps
2001 F150 5.4 Super cab short bed 4x4
2013 F150 Ecoboost. Crew cab short bed 4x4

wrd1972
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#39 Post by wrd1972 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:48 pm

OP,
I have a NV log 21' party barge and can speak to strakes performance in great detail.

When I am alone, I average 35MPH with a 13.25" X 16P PROP @ 58OO rpm. This is my most commonly used prop.

I can put my 13.25" x 17 prop on and get 36-37MPH but that is very dependent on smooth water and getting out of the hole is tougher. RPMs here are around 5600 or so and top speeds are much more inconsistent. I also hit 43MPH with this prop one day due to a massive tailwind.

With the family of four on the boat (~530 pounds), I can still easily make 33-34MPH @ about 5700 RPM. If another pair of adults join us, the boat will start to slow some and in that case, I can put my 13.75" x 15P prop on and get quite a bit more torque to the water and RPMs out of the motor. Even with about 900 pounds and the 15P prop, I can still make 30+ MPH. With more weight on-board beyond this, things severely bog down.

I recently had six adults and five kids (well over 1300 pounds), and it was a slug boat making a whopping 16MPH.

If you are going to add strakes to an existing boat, make sure they know what they are doing. I would tend to think that the engineering behind them is very complex and well over the head of most customizers. Lastly, I would never ever get another toon that did not have strakes because my boat gives me the same speed and the wind in the face as a small 4 banger run-about. Its also fun passing every single 2 log boat on the lake as well as many three loggers and some smaller v-hulls.
2008 Sun Tracker Party Barge 21' 2 Log NV performance Package, 90HP 4 stroke Mercury. 37MPH avg. on GPS.

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DRock
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#40 Post by DRock » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:04 pm

wrd1972 wrote:OP,
I have a NV log 21' party barge and can speak to strakes performance in great detail.

When I am alone, I average 35MPH with a 13.25" X 16P PROP @ 58OO rpm. This is my most commonly used prop.

I can put my 13.25" x 17 prop on and get 36-37MPH but that is very dependent on smooth water and getting out of the hole is tougher. RPMs here are around 5600 or so and top speeds are much more inconsistent. I also hit 43MPH with this prop one day due to a massive tailwind.

With the family of four on the boat (~530 pounds), I can still easily make 33-34MPH @ about 5700 RPM. If another pair of adults join us, the boat will start to slow some and in that case, I can put my 13.75" x 15P prop on and get quite a bit more torque to the water and RPMs out of the motor. Even with about 900 pounds and the 15P prop, I can still make 30+ MPH. With more weight on-board beyond this, things severely bog down.

I recently had six adults and five kids (well over 1300 pounds), and it was a slug boat making a whopping 16MPH.

If you are going to add strakes to an existing boat, make sure they know what they are doing. I would tend to think that the engineering behind them is very complex and well over the head of most customizers. Lastly, I would never ever get another toon that did not have strakes because my boat gives me the same speed and the wind in the face as a small 4 banger run-about. Its also fun passing every single 2 log boat on the lake as well as many three loggers and some smaller v-hulls.
My whole plan was to copy a manufacturer's strakes. The 2 companies i had it narrowed down to were Sylvan and Bennington. I could not copy them exactly, though, because they had 25" toons and i have 23" toons. That was one thing that was lingering in my head. My 23" toon boat will sit lower in the water(all other things equal ie weight) than a 25" toon boat. That would in theory make it harder for my boat to get on plane, correct? Doesn't your NV straked boat have 27" toons?

I guess over the weekend while driving down the lake i came to the conclusion that my rig is running pretty darn good for 90hp on a 20' 23" toon boat. I would hate to put strakes on, be dissatisfied, and end up having to buy $2-4k worth of new toons to get back to where i am now. It runs 30-31mph gps with just me depending on conditions, 28-30 mph with me and my wife depending on fuel, bimini, and load, and 26-28 with 4 adults onboard. I cruise at 18-21 mph usually at 3800-4200 rpms.
2006 20' Odyssey 220C. 2006 Mercury 90 4s. Underskinned, jackplate. 13.5x15 SS prop. 31mph gps
2001 F150 5.4 Super cab short bed 4x4
2013 F150 Ecoboost. Crew cab short bed 4x4

Bamaman
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#41 Post by Bamaman » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:52 pm

DRock: Your 90 is running better than many people's 115 hp motors. It appears you've got a good one, with a good setup.

Have you thought abou putting underskin on your boat? I'm surprised how much quieter and smoother my boat is at cruise speeds than my old pontoon without underskinning.
'12 Bennington 24' SSLX Yamaha 150

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DRock
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#42 Post by DRock » Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:28 pm

Bamaman wrote:DRock: Your 90 is running better than many people's 115 hp motors. It appears you've got a good one, with a good setup.

Have you thought abou putting underskin on your boat? I'm surprised how much quieter and smoother my boat is at cruise speeds than my old pontoon without underskinning.
I have put underskinning on my boat. Here's the thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=16208&p=133039&hili ... in#p133039

I agree that it was a good investment. Much smoother and quieter ride with no more surging. I didn't gain any speed but didn't lose any either.
2006 20' Odyssey 220C. 2006 Mercury 90 4s. Underskinned, jackplate. 13.5x15 SS prop. 31mph gps
2001 F150 5.4 Super cab short bed 4x4
2013 F150 Ecoboost. Crew cab short bed 4x4

wrd1972
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#43 Post by wrd1972 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:34 pm

My NV logs are 26" I believe.
2008 Sun Tracker Party Barge 21' 2 Log NV performance Package, 90HP 4 stroke Mercury. 37MPH avg. on GPS.

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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#44 Post by jayw » Tue Jun 25, 2013 1:41 pm

If you can run that 90HP up to 30MPH you are doing unbelievable on that boat. Is that boat an 8 or 8.5 beam? That's about the fastest I've seen a 90 push a pontoon of that size. Of course weight is everything.

Typically 115HP is considered the base minimum HP for strakes. Of course there are variables that come into play, maybe strakes would work for you. There is no way IMO you will ever get to the upper 30s with that setup, strakes or not. If you do you will be setting a record.

I've always heard, rule of thumb is 7%, MAX 10% increase with strakes. So if your boat does 30 AND you have the HP to back it, you may climb 2 MPH. If you have a 50 MPH pontoon the strakes could boost you 4 MPH. Maybe a hair more.

Strakes smooth out the ride more than anything, and get you higher out of the water for reduced friction. Note the engine size on the pontoon pic you posted - looks like a 150 etec.

If you are underpowered with strakes you will LOSE speed due to increased friction.

IMO never let ANYONE install strakes except the factory that made the boat. Fix is one thing. Getting the geometry right, that's another.

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curtiscapk
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Re: Talk me in or out of strakes

#45 Post by curtiscapk » Tue Jun 25, 2013 1:50 pm

DRock wrote:. It runs 30-31mph gps with just me depending on conditions, 28-30 mph with me and my wife depending on fuel, bimini, and load, and 26-28 with 4 adults onboard. I cruise at 18-21 mph usually at 3800-4200 rpms.
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: Geezuz!
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viewtopic.php?f=2&t=15328
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